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| itsme_001 |
 Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 8:39 pm Post subject: |
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Disciple
Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
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| SAFraser wrote: |
If you are looking for evidence of specific transaction activity, why not check some statistics inside MQ? Such as last put/get dates & times, channel activity, and so forth.
I think we are not clear about what it is you are trying to prove to your customer....? |
my customer wants to know the transaction details which has happened thru MQ....
?? How to get the details regarding last put/get dates & times, channel activity, and so forth[/quote] |
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| fjb_saper |
| Posted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 18 Nov 2003
Posts: 20767
Location: LI,NY
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| itsme_001 wrote: |
my customer wants to know the transaction details which has happened thru MQ....
?? How to get the details regarding last put/get dates & times, channel activity, and so forth |
So have his application log the transaction details, the messageId these were sent on and the destination they were sent to. On the destination and along the route all you need is qmgrId, messageId and time. If the route is of no interest to you, you only need to log at the sender app and receiving/ processing app.
Enjoy 
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MQ & Broker admin |
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 12:47 am Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| itsme_001 wrote: |
| my customer wants to know the transaction details which has happened thru MQ.... |
Which is not recorded in these logs for all messages, and not in any format that is usable.
And certainly doesn't contain information of any failed transactions!
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Honesty is the best policy.
Insanity is the best defence. |
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| SAFraser |
| Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:15 am Post subject: |
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Shaman
Joined: 22 Oct 2003
Posts: 742
Location: Austin, Texas, USA
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I continue to struggle to understand your requirement.
Your customer needs such details for every transaction? (No, they really don't. And as others say, if they do, that is a function of the application, not MQ.)
Or your customer needs to know that a particular server has been active?
| Quote: |
| the issue here is that, after last week when there was a reboot of the server; since then there hasn't been a single log created. i need to those logs to be available for verification purpose to check if the transaction has happened properly or not. |
Or volumes? Or what? |
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| kevinf2349 |
| Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:30 am Post subject: |
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Grand Master
Joined: 28 Feb 2003
Posts: 1311
Location: USA
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I guess the customer will next want details of all the TCPIP packets that are sent.....that should be fun! 
Maybe we should ask the US Post office to provide details of all the mail they delivered too? That MIGHT be useful for an audit? 
As other people have said, and I am firmly in agreement. The applications have to start taking their own accountabilty seriously and stop put it off onto the infrastructure to provide. The application is where this truly belongs...fight, kick, claw...heck even use the above example of the post office in your defence, but resist!  |
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| RogerLacroix |
| Posted: Thu Feb 19, 2009 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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Jedi Knight
Joined: 15 May 2001
Posts: 3264
Location: London, ON Canada
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| itsme_001 wrote: |
my customer wants to know the transaction details which has happened thru MQ....
?? How to get the details regarding last put/get dates & times, channel activity, and so forth |
There are several commercial products that can give you this kind of detail.
I have a web page with a list of commercial MQ products and you need to review the "Message Tracking" products:
http://www.capitalware.biz/mq_tools_comm.html#mqtrk
Regards,
Roger Lacroix
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Capitalware: Transforming tomorrow into today.
Connected to MQ!
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| itsme_001 |
| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:06 am Post subject: Logs needed |
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Disciple
Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
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Same issue cropped up again.....
one application has sent 20 msgs to MQ and MQ has reverted them to another application; but only 18 of them have been recieved.
Need to track the number of messages MQ has recieved and number of messages sent frm MQ. |
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| exerk |
| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:29 am Post subject: Re: Logs needed |
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Jedi Council
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Posts: 6339
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| itsme_001 wrote: |
| ...one application has sent 20 msgs to MQ and MQ has reverted them to another application; but only 18 of them have been received... |
Sounds like the classic business cry of; "MQ has lost my messages". How do they know an application PUT 20 messages to a queue manager? Have them prove that. Do they set expiry on some messages and not others? In which case WMQ will have done what it says on the tin, and delivered valid messages only.
| itsme_001 wrote: |
| ...Need to track the number of messages MQ has recieved and number of messages sent frm MQ. |
Oh no you don't! They do!
My esteemed Master has suggested the use of a trouting... 
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It's puzzling, I don't think I've ever seen anything quite like this before...and it's hard to soar like an eagle when you're surrounded by turkeys. |
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:43 am Post subject: Re: Logs needed |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| exerk wrote: |
| Sounds like the classic business cry of; "MQ has lost my messages". How do they know an application PUT 20 messages to a queue manager? Have them prove that. Do they set expiry on some messages and not others? In which case WMQ will have done what it says on the tin, and delivered valid messages only. |
(I'm like a proud father.....  )
To underline this - they claim 20 messages were put successfully. If so, they claim only 18 were delivered. Assuming that 20 were put successfully, what they're actually saying is "only 18 were delivered where we expected". The "missing" 2 could be in a different queue, set to expire, be non-persistent or (my personal favorite) been badly processed by the receiving application and not appeared on the total of messages processed.
Yes, that is a real world example. I was told WMQ was only delivering about 90% of messages to an application; investigation revealed the application was only totalling successfully processed messages. Around 10% failed for business reasons and should have been on a different report. Except it didn't work. You should have seen their little faces when they realised their application only looked 100% successful because the failure report was failing. I laughed. A lot.
Every experienced WMQ person has a war story like this; "WMQ has lost my message" is the manta of the application person.
_________________
Honesty is the best policy.
Insanity is the best defence. |
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| exerk |
| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:51 am Post subject: Re: Logs needed |
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Jedi Council
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Posts: 6339
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| Vitor wrote: |
| (I'm like a proud father..... ) |
Thanks dad...can I have my pocket money now please?
| Vitor wrote: |
| ...Every experienced WMQ person has a war story like this; "WMQ has lost my message" is the mantra of the application person. |
To which I would add: "It's always our fault", no matter what. Too many times have I fettled WMQ to try and mitigate the problem of bad application design - WMQ is not just a piece of Cat 5 cable, which is how it is generally viewed, outside of the 'community'.
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It's puzzling, I don't think I've ever seen anything quite like this before...and it's hard to soar like an eagle when you're surrounded by turkeys. |
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| itsme_001 |
| Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 10:41 pm Post subject: |
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Disciple
Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
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The question arised here is that:
Wht is the purpose of using MQ when we can't trace whether there are "n" number of messages sent thru MQ have not reached the destination.
Can't we keep a track of the status of these messages. |
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| Vitor |
| Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:17 am Post subject: |
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Grand High Poobah
Joined: 11 Nov 2005
Posts: 26093
Location: Texas, USA
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| itsme_001 wrote: |
| Wht is the purpose of using MQ when we can't trace whether there are "n" number of messages sent thru MQ have not reached the destination. |
The purpose of WMQ is removing the need to trace if "n" messages have reached the destination - look up "assured delivery" in the IBM sales pitch!
The whole point is that WMQ provides a mechanism that TCP/IP does not, assuring the delivery once and once only of messages in the face of failures and network issues.
| itsme_001 wrote: |
| Can't we keep a track of the status of these messages. |
Not out of the box because you don't need to - that's the point! 
_________________
Honesty is the best policy.
Insanity is the best defence. |
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| exerk |
| Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 1:18 am Post subject: |
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Jedi Council
Joined: 02 Nov 2006
Posts: 6339
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The purpose of WMQ is to move messages around a network; the purpose of applications is to produce/consume those messages. To use the postal service analogy, do you expect the postal service, which handles millions of letters (messages) per day, to track every letter (message) given it to deliver by hundreds of thousands of customers (applications)? You might track certain very important items (recorded delivery, or special delivery) but of the bulk - no.
As has been mentioned within this thread, there are third-party offerings that will do what you want, or application journalling can (and should in my opinion) be used, but other than COA and COD messages, and there is plenty of discussion on the board in regard to those, there is nothing inherent in WMQ that I know of that will do it to the level of detail you seem to require.
Back to the postal service analogy; if I want to send something via the service, and I consider it so critical that I want to be able to track its progress, do I just put it in the post box then cross my fingers and hope it arrives, thereby absolving any responsibility? Or do I accept that it is my responsibility to record giving it to the postal service (MsgID returned) and reconcile receipt with the receiving party?
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It's puzzling, I don't think I've ever seen anything quite like this before...and it's hard to soar like an eagle when you're surrounded by turkeys. |
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| itsme_001 |
| Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2009 2:09 am Post subject: |
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Disciple
Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
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thank you very much....
this answered a lot of my questions |
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| itsme_001 |
| Posted: Tue Mar 17, 2009 3:33 am Post subject: |
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Disciple
Joined: 02 Feb 2009
Posts: 157
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The same thing happening again, we encountered that; out of all the messages sent thru MQ some 10 msgs are missing.
By checking the log file in the path Programfiles/IBM/Websphere MQ/log/QMGR/actove/S0000000.LOG ; we found that details r available for present date and previous date were overwritten.
I need to make sure that previous 3 days logs should be avavilable at any given time.
Can I increase the Log size in the QM properties for 3-4 days transaction detail log???? |
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